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Author Topic: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion  (Read 24358 times)

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Offline Dick in Shorts

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #300 on: Apr 21, 2022, 08:43:33 »
Keve - you haven’t told us your COURSE handicap - this will show how many shots you received for the nett double bogey hole - this may be different from your Playing handicap.
The stroke indexes and pars will also be needed
« Last Edit: Apr 21, 2022, 09:04:46 by Dick in Shorts »
:ping: G400 SFT 12 deg driver
:ping: G400 SFT  5 wood
:ping: G400  4(22 deg) & 5(26) deg) Hybrids
:wilson: Staff D300 6 - PW
:titleist: SM6 50/54/58 deg
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Prize Money: 2010=£276  2011=£406 +2 bottles Malt Whisky 
 2012=£351 2013=£95 2014=£240 2015=£225 2016=£475
2017=£368 2018= £767 2019=£582 2020=£284 2021=£105
2022=£330

2021 WHS HI: 12.1>10.8>15.2
2022 WHS HI: 15.2>9.8>12.9

InverurieGC winter handicap - 10
NE Alliance handicap- 13

2022: winners Alford Mixed G’somes

Offline Blofeld

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #301 on: Apr 21, 2022, 09:33:05 »
Keve - you haven’t told us your COURSE handicap - this will show how many shots you received for the nett double bogey hole - this may be different from your Playing handicap.
The stroke indexes and pars will also be needed

Dick....the nett double bogey hole is Par 5 SI 17. The screenshots show his PH as being 10....his CH therefore cannot be any more than 11.
Callaway Rogue ST Max LS 9* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 55 reg
Callaway Rogue ST LS 3-wood 15* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 65 reg
Callaway Rogue 5-wood 18* / Aldila Synergy 60 reg
Callaway Apex Utility Wood 21* / Project X Hzrdus Smoke 70 5.5
Callaway Apex (2016) 4H 20* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
Callaway Apex (2016) 5H 23* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
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L.A.B. Directed Force 2.1

Offline Dick in Shorts

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #302 on: Apr 21, 2022, 16:03:29 »
What about par and SI of 18 ?
:ping: G400 SFT 12 deg driver
:ping: G400 SFT  5 wood
:ping: G400  4(22 deg) & 5(26) deg) Hybrids
:wilson: Staff D300 6 - PW
:titleist: SM6 50/54/58 deg
:scottycameron: Futura 5S
:honma: A1

Prize Money: 2010=£276  2011=£406 +2 bottles Malt Whisky 
 2012=£351 2013=£95 2014=£240 2015=£225 2016=£475
2017=£368 2018= £767 2019=£582 2020=£284 2021=£105
2022=£330

2021 WHS HI: 12.1>10.8>15.2
2022 WHS HI: 15.2>9.8>12.9

InverurieGC winter handicap - 10
NE Alliance handicap- 13

2022: winners Alford Mixed G’somes

Offline Blofeld

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #303 on: Apr 21, 2022, 17:11:29 »
What about par and SI of 18 ?

Par 4 SI 8....so again not affected by any potential difference in CH/PH
Callaway Rogue ST Max LS 9* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 55 reg
Callaway Rogue ST LS 3-wood 15* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 65 reg
Callaway Rogue 5-wood 18* / Aldila Synergy 60 reg
Callaway Apex Utility Wood 21* / Project X Hzrdus Smoke 70 5.5
Callaway Apex (2016) 4H 20* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
Callaway Apex (2016) 5H 23* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
Callaway Apex CF19 6-AW / TT Elevate 95 reg
Vega Alcor 54* & Vega VWY 60* / Shimada Wedge flex
L.A.B. Directed Force 2.1

Offline Cols_Ears

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #304 on: Aug 15, 2022, 15:56:55 »
Nick - I have a question for you as our WHS Guru:

How is the individual round Score Differential actually calculated, as despite having a university degree in engineering I'll be buggered if I can work it out...

So yesterday I shot a 73, I have a WHS Index of 4.1, I played at Tidworth Garrison GC, white tees ( Course rating 71.5 / Slope 130) giving me a course handicap of 5.
According the the EGU MyGolf app this gives me a Score differential of 1.3 (PCC was zero, as it has been since they introduced the WHS at our place).

How do you calculate the 1.3??

Other random scores are with SD after the / and HCap in brackets - all on the same course / tees and zero PCC:

77 / 4.8 (4.6)
87 / 13.5 (4.4)
81 / 8.3 (4.1)
74 / 2.2 (4.7)
73 / 1.3 (6.0) - this is the one I don't understand - how can this score when played off a higher WHS Index and course handicap give the same score differential as the 73 I posted yesterday?

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Offline Blofeld

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #305 on: Aug 15, 2022, 17:44:17 »
Nick - I have a question for you as our WHS Guru:

How is the individual round Score Differential actually calculated, as despite having a university degree in engineering I'll be buggered if I can work it out...

So yesterday I shot a 73, I have a WHS Index of 4.1, I played at Tidworth Garrison GC, white tees ( Course rating 71.5 / Slope 130) giving me a course handicap of 5.
According the the EGU MyGolf app this gives me a Score differential of 1.3 (PCC was zero, as it has been since they introduced the WHS at our place).

How do you calculate the 1.3??

Other random scores are with SD after the / and HCap in brackets - all on the same course / tees and zero PCC:

77 / 4.8 (4.6)
87 / 13.5 (4.4)
81 / 8.3 (4.1)
74 / 2.2 (4.7)
73 / 1.3 (6.0) - this is the one I don't understand - how can this score when played off a higher WHS Index and course handicap give the same score differential as the 73 I posted yesterday?

Ok....so first of all....your existing/current WHS index or course handicap plays no part whatsoever in the calculation of your score differential.

The score differential is purely a function of your score, compared with Course Rating and then normalised to a course with a Slope rating of 113.

Score Differential =(113/slope rating)*(adjusted gross score - course rating - pcc)

So in your case Score Differential = (113/130)*(73-71.5-0)

which you will find is your 1.3
Callaway Rogue ST Max LS 9* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 55 reg
Callaway Rogue ST LS 3-wood 15* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 65 reg
Callaway Rogue 5-wood 18* / Aldila Synergy 60 reg
Callaway Apex Utility Wood 21* / Project X Hzrdus Smoke 70 5.5
Callaway Apex (2016) 4H 20* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
Callaway Apex (2016) 5H 23* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
Callaway Apex CF19 6-AW / TT Elevate 95 reg
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L.A.B. Directed Force 2.1

Offline Cols_Ears

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #306 on: Aug 16, 2022, 09:54:28 »
Ok....so first of all....your existing/current WHS index or course handicap plays no part whatsoever in the calculation of your score differential.

The score differential is purely a function of your score, compared with Course Rating and then normalised to a course with a Slope rating of 113.

Score Differential =(113/slope rating)*(adjusted gross score - course rating - pcc)

So in your case Score Differential = (113/130)*(73-71.5-0)

which you will find is your 1.3
Thank Nick - much appreciated.
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Offline Keve

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World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #307 on: Aug 16, 2022, 15:44:58 »
I just accept now that the differential is what it is but last weeks at the Downfield open made me scratch my head.
I had a shocker of a round, scoring 2 7's an 8 and a 9 for 88, gross adjusted to 85 on a par 73 course. In my, and everyone else's defense, the course had been set up the day before for some international boy/girls event with flags perched on ridges and the greens running like putting on car bonnets.
I woke up at 3.30am for my usual pee and was stunned to see the differential was 8.1 and I had been cut by 0.6.
The winning score in Div 1 was 74, 1 over net so very tough.

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« Last Edit: Aug 16, 2022, 15:54:01 by Keve »

Offline Blofeld

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #308 on: Aug 16, 2022, 18:49:48 »
I just accept now that the differential is what it is but last weeks at the Downfield open made me scratch my head.
I had a shocker of a round, scoring 2 7's an 8 and a 9 for 88, gross adjusted to 85 on a par 73 course. In my, and everyone else's defense, the course had been set up the day before for some international boy/girls event with flags perched on ridges and the greens running like putting on car bonnets.
I woke up at 3.30am for my usual pee and was stunned to see the differential was 8.1 and I had been cut by 0.6.
The winning score in Div 1 was 74, 1 over net so very tough.

Sent from my SM-S906B using Tapatalk

Assuming I've got the right course (Slope 133 CR 73.5), this would indicate to me that there was a Course Condition Adjustment of 2 for the scores for the day.

So (85-73.5-2)*(113/133) will give you 8.1 (after rounding)
Callaway Rogue ST Max LS 9* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 55 reg
Callaway Rogue ST LS 3-wood 15* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 65 reg
Callaway Rogue 5-wood 18* / Aldila Synergy 60 reg
Callaway Apex Utility Wood 21* / Project X Hzrdus Smoke 70 5.5
Callaway Apex (2016) 4H 20* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
Callaway Apex (2016) 5H 23* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
Callaway Apex CF19 6-AW / TT Elevate 95 reg
Vega Alcor 54* & Vega VWY 60* / Shimada Wedge flex
L.A.B. Directed Force 2.1

Offline braehead

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #309 on: Nov 20, 2022, 22:25:27 »
It might be in this thread somewhere already but how does WHS work during winter with mats, preferred lies, temp greens etc?  I've had a few good general play games recently but not put cards in because of the occasional temp green etc. Should I just be putting them in anyway? From next month we move to fairway mats too but we're getting to the period where we're lucky to have enough daylight to play anyway 😳

Offline Dick in Shorts

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #310 on: Nov 21, 2022, 08:14:40 »
Most - if not all- courses in NE Scotland have no measured course for the winter period due to forward tees ,mats to be used in first cut, winter bunker rules etc etc not to mention being on winter greens too.

You’d need to check with your club if the ‘winter’ course has been ‘rated’
:ping: G400 SFT 12 deg driver
:ping: G400 SFT  5 wood
:ping: G400  4(22 deg) & 5(26) deg) Hybrids
:wilson: Staff D300 6 - PW
:titleist: SM6 50/54/58 deg
:scottycameron: Futura 5S
:honma: A1

Prize Money: 2010=£276  2011=£406 +2 bottles Malt Whisky 
 2012=£351 2013=£95 2014=£240 2015=£225 2016=£475
2017=£368 2018= £767 2019=£582 2020=£284 2021=£105
2022=£330

2021 WHS HI: 12.1>10.8>15.2
2022 WHS HI: 15.2>9.8>12.9

InverurieGC winter handicap - 10
NE Alliance handicap- 13

2022: winners Alford Mixed G’somes

Offline Blofeld

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #311 on: Nov 21, 2022, 09:53:13 »
It might be in this thread somewhere already but how does WHS work during winter with mats, preferred lies, temp greens etc?  I've had a few good general play games recently but not put cards in because of the occasional temp green etc. Should I just be putting them in anyway? From next month we move to fairway mats too but we're getting to the period where we're lucky to have enough daylight to play anyway 😳

Assuming that the course still is within 100yds of its measured playing length then the following applies in England (Scotland may do things differently as the authority to decide what counts as a handicap qualifying round lies with the Authorised Association...so England Golf, Scottish Golf Union etc)...

Mats (tees and fairway mats)
Acceptable Scores may be returned in Competitions and in General Play when there is a Local Rule in place requiring the compulsory use of fairway mats to protect the natural surfaces of the course, during the referred lies period.

Suggested wording for local rule - ‘When a player’s ball lies in a part of the general area cut to fairway height or less and a putter is not being used for the stroke, the ball must be lifted, placed on and played from an Astroturf, or similar type, of mat. The mat must be placed as near as possible to where the ball originally lay, and the ball must be placed on the mat. The ball may be cleaned when lifted.’

Temporary Greens
For scores to be acceptable, no more than 2 temporary greens are allowed to be used. For a 9-hole course, only one temporary green will be allowed. Whilst temporary or alternative greens are acceptable for handicapping purposes, whenever the length of the course length has been increased or decreased by more than 100 yards for an 18-hole round or 50 yards for a 9-hole round, the adjustments to the Course Rating and Slope Rating set out in Appendix G of the Rules of Handicapping must be applied.

Callaway Rogue ST Max LS 9* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 55 reg
Callaway Rogue ST LS 3-wood 15* / Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 65 reg
Callaway Rogue 5-wood 18* / Aldila Synergy 60 reg
Callaway Apex Utility Wood 21* / Project X Hzrdus Smoke 70 5.5
Callaway Apex (2016) 4H 20* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
Callaway Apex (2016) 5H 23* / Mitsubishi Kuro Kage 80g reg
Callaway Apex CF19 6-AW / TT Elevate 95 reg
Vega Alcor 54* & Vega VWY 60* / Shimada Wedge flex
L.A.B. Directed Force 2.1

Offline braehead

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #312 on: Nov 21, 2022, 13:43:52 »
That's great - thanks very much.  I'd have been fine to put a score in today in that case as the Eden was ok.  But Ladybank had 4 temp greens the other day so that would have been a no. 

My winter golf is generally bounce games where none of the group want to hole out or put cards in but I'm quite keen to put a card in for all (well, most) of my games.  Good to know the above info.

Offline Dick in Shorts

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Re: World Handicapping Scheme Education Discussion
« Reply #313 on: Nov 21, 2022, 17:29:24 »
You should be able to check with the club or professional shop at the course you are playing before you commence your round. Last winter I was at Murcar and it’s usually all full summer greens - having checked in the pro shop I discovered there were 4 winter greens at the far end of the course (due to maintenance) that would have been unknown if I hadn’t asked!
:ping: G400 SFT 12 deg driver
:ping: G400 SFT  5 wood
:ping: G400  4(22 deg) & 5(26) deg) Hybrids
:wilson: Staff D300 6 - PW
:titleist: SM6 50/54/58 deg
:scottycameron: Futura 5S
:honma: A1

Prize Money: 2010=£276  2011=£406 +2 bottles Malt Whisky 
 2012=£351 2013=£95 2014=£240 2015=£225 2016=£475
2017=£368 2018= £767 2019=£582 2020=£284 2021=£105
2022=£330

2021 WHS HI: 12.1>10.8>15.2
2022 WHS HI: 15.2>9.8>12.9

InverurieGC winter handicap - 10
NE Alliance handicap- 13

2022: winners Alford Mixed G’somes

 

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